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Tell your friends about us!Any opinions on the new R8?
- Thread starter Lili
- Start date
odklizec
PK
Nice looking upgrade. I like the GRD look of R8 body. Especially the silver one is very nice and classy-looking.
I'm mainly curious about three things.
How loud is the AF and zoom?
How good/bad is highlight clipping?
And finally, how good/bad is the NR at ISO400/800?
Pity the R8 sensor is not the same as used in GRDII or GX100. Or at least the RAW for advanced users and shutterbugs. Either of these two features would make the R8 a real competitor in its class. Especially RAW output (even slow) would be nice for restoring highligts and details at high ISO. A/P/M modes would be nice, but not as important as RAW.
I hope to get a R8 sample for test and comparison with my fiance's R7.
I'm mainly curious about three things.
How loud is the AF and zoom?
How good/bad is highlight clipping?
And finally, how good/bad is the NR at ISO400/800?
Pity the R8 sensor is not the same as used in GRDII or GX100. Or at least the RAW for advanced users and shutterbugs. Either of these two features would make the R8 a real competitor in its class. Especially RAW output (even slow) would be nice for restoring highligts and details at high ISO. A/P/M modes would be nice, but not as important as RAW.
I hope to get a R8 sample for test and comparison with my fiance's R7.
VladimirV
New Member
I will just repost what I wrote in the dpreview forum.
I think it looks good and is a good upgrade from the R7 or older cameras. As this is the budget line for Ricoh they do not need to reinvent themselves every time and they have consistently improved the series. The controls got better with each generation and the handgrip is a nice addition as it will improve the handling.
Also looking at the pictures the camera seems made out of metal and much better built.
I like that Ricoh brings the R and G series closer together with the design.
No one honestly expected this to be a GX100 with a 7x zoom so there have to be compromises but at least from the design and controls it looks like the best R series camera so far. No more plastic and "cheap" looking. I hope Ricoh also re-used the old DB-60 battery (does not look like it from the specs now) so it will be a great complement for the GRD II.
IMHO the best R series so far judging from the design and homnestly the IQ should also be better, especially downsized at R4 level.
These features are IMO pretty interesting and should help it stand against the Fuji and Panasonic:
-High-resolution 2.7-inch, 460,000-pixel HVGA LCD (better than a squinty useless OVF)
- Square format photography (only Ricoh offers this so far)
-AF/AE Target shift functions provided (like to have this in the GRD)
One thing I want to mention i that it looks really cool, great new design and for me this alone would be worth the upgrade
.
I think it looks good and is a good upgrade from the R7 or older cameras. As this is the budget line for Ricoh they do not need to reinvent themselves every time and they have consistently improved the series. The controls got better with each generation and the handgrip is a nice addition as it will improve the handling.
Also looking at the pictures the camera seems made out of metal and much better built.
I like that Ricoh brings the R and G series closer together with the design.
No one honestly expected this to be a GX100 with a 7x zoom so there have to be compromises but at least from the design and controls it looks like the best R series camera so far. No more plastic and "cheap" looking. I hope Ricoh also re-used the old DB-60 battery (does not look like it from the specs now) so it will be a great complement for the GRD II.
IMHO the best R series so far judging from the design and homnestly the IQ should also be better, especially downsized at R4 level.
These features are IMO pretty interesting and should help it stand against the Fuji and Panasonic:
-High-resolution 2.7-inch, 460,000-pixel HVGA LCD (better than a squinty useless OVF)
- Square format photography (only Ricoh offers this so far)
-AF/AE Target shift functions provided (like to have this in the GRD)
One thing I want to mention i that it looks really cool, great new design and for me this alone would be worth the upgrade
.
Lili
New Member
Pavel and Vladimir,
I REALLY liked the look of this in Black.
The snap and infiniy focus simply rock, esp if these work at ALL focal lengths.
I think Isaw that it has contrast and saturation controls as well.
If it has sharpness I will be in heaven, LOL
Also, what of this 460,000 pixel screen?
I REALLY liked the look of this in Black.
The snap and infiniy focus simply rock, esp if these work at ALL focal lengths.
I think Isaw that it has contrast and saturation controls as well.
If it has sharpness I will be in heaven, LOL
Also, what of this 460,000 pixel screen?
odklizec
PK
I think this 460k could be a great helper for manual focus. Higher resolution means more displayed details at pixel level. For example, GRDII LCD is great (much better than R7 LCD). But if it comes to Manual focus (with enlarged central part of LCD), it's not detailed enough to judge proper focus.
odklizec
PK
There is a first R8 review available (rather short customer's experience):
http://www.thinkcamera.com/news/article ... 98/v/3/sp/
I especially found interesting this sentence:
"It takes a little while to learn how to do manual properly on the Ricoh R8, because shutter and aperture priority and manual are driven from the rear thumb controller button, rather than options on the top thumbwheel."
Does it mean there is a manually controllable shutter speed and aperture in R8?
http://www.thinkcamera.com/news/article ... 98/v/3/sp/
I especially found interesting this sentence:
"It takes a little while to learn how to do manual properly on the Ricoh R8, because shutter and aperture priority and manual are driven from the rear thumb controller button, rather than options on the top thumbwheel."
Does it mean there is a manually controllable shutter speed and aperture in R8?
odklizec
PK
I really hope they did not broke the R7 engine. The new "smooth engine III" sounds scary for me
I don't think the GX100 JPEG is a crap. From ISO80 to ISO200 the JPEG/RAW difference is unnoticeable. It's still fine at ISO400 with a lost of preserved details (unlike the GRDII JPEG) and at ISO 800 and 1600..well, it's crap But it's still much better than GRDII JPEG at the same ISO. Noisy, but not so smeared. I like the R7 way of cleaning chroma noise and preserving luminance noise. I hope the same is done in R8.
I don't think the GX100 JPEG is a crap. From ISO80 to ISO200 the JPEG/RAW difference is unnoticeable. It's still fine at ISO400 with a lost of preserved details (unlike the GRDII JPEG) and at ISO 800 and 1600..well, it's crap
But it's still much better than GRDII JPEG at the same ISO. Noisy, but not so smeared. I like the R7 way of cleaning chroma noise and preserving luminance noise. I hope the same is done in R8.even though its OT: I was not very precise, I do save my raw-conversations as jpeg file that have approximately the same size as from the camera. I'm speaking of a more advanced demosaicing that is possible on the PC. Jpeg compression is definetly not the problem.
But what I really want is less clipped highlights, I hope this is better in the R8....
But what I really want is less clipped highlights, I hope this is better in the R8....
odklizec
PK
odklizec":1ohchz2h said:
OK guys. I have two news. One bad and one good
Let's start with "bad" news..well, not THAT bad. It will just "kill" our hope in A/P/S/M modes via camera menu and make the things clear. I asked my contact in Ricoh about this particular part of this "thinkcamera" R8 hands-on review and I was told it must be a mistake. There is just an option in R8 menu allowing to set the "minimum aperture" value.
But there is no shutter/aperture priority or full manual mode in R8! It seems the reviewer was probably messed up with "minimum aperture" option. So I'm sorry guys, but there is definitely no "manual" mode in R8
And now the good news! I should get the R8 for test! There are not enough sample units in Europe yet, but once they will arrive to Germany, I should get one ASAP! And because my fiance already got R7 from me as a Christmas present, I will be able to do some direct R7/R8 comparisons and tests!
So feel free to post your requests about this or that particular test and comparison, you would like to read about.
Tom Caldwell
New Member
Pavel
One might wonder why a reviewer could get it that wrong?
Casts the rest of the review into doubt if such a casual, incorrect comment could be made on what is an important "feature".
Tom
One might wonder why a reviewer could get it that wrong?
Casts the rest of the review into doubt if such a casual, incorrect comment could be made on what is an important "feature".
Tom
odklizec
PK
Tom,
I think the key role in this mistake was played by the time pressure. This hands-on "preview" (rather than review) was written in a very short time after the official announcement. There are not enough review samples yet and they wanted to be the first who will publish their findings. So here we are I'm sure, they will correct their mistake. No one is infallible and the Ricoh cameras are packed with features. One can easily make a mistake if time is pressing on.
I think the key role in this mistake was played by the time pressure. This hands-on "preview" (rather than review) was written in a very short time after the official announcement. There are not enough review samples yet and they wanted to be the first who will publish their findings. So here we are
I'm sure, they will correct their mistake. No one is infallible and the Ricoh cameras are packed with features. One can easily make a mistake if time is pressing on.MM, sure, but the camera has to do the RAW conversion fast with a lot less processing power and using algorithms and setting designed for average cases. I'm pretty sure that there is no RAW to JPEG conversion in the world that would keep all the sort of users that buy GR-Ds and GX100s happy: improve it for me and it'll piss of someone else. Compression results in trade-offs.
Before the GX100 I had a fuji e550, which also could shoot raw (at the same speed as the gx100!), but to my eye the processing was ok (the difference between raw and jpag was not a lot) and I stopped using raw. I do of course understand that a PC conversion will always be better, but IMO ricoh has to do better than what the gx100 jpeg engine delivers.
The point is, I don't mind using raw as I like playing around with good shots. But it simply is not availiable in the R series, so a better jpeg highlight handling is an issue for me.
The point is, I don't mind using raw as I like playing around with good shots. But it simply is not availiable in the R series, so a better jpeg highlight handling is an issue for me.
odklizec
PK
I agree that RAW is better in many aspects, especially for highlight recovery and noise processing. As for me, RAW should be as an optional output for advanced users in all small sensor cameras. I think it's even more important than aperture or shutter speed priority (in small sensor cameras). But it's just my personal point of view