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Leica X1

C

CHICHORNIO

New Member
Joined
May 26, 2009
Messages
273
Any clue if Ricoh will release a GR type of camera with the size and type of sensor that comes with the new Leica X1? Take a look a dpreview (http://www.dpreview.com/news/0909/09090908leicax1.asp). It sounds to me that the X1 will be the dreamed camera to carry around. I hope Ricoh will make this type of camera in the near future. Until then, I´ll keep the GRII with me.
 
Looks like nice and expensive toy with nowhere as good execution as GRDIII or even DP2 or LX3!

At first, the X1 focal length is 36mm. I think 40mm f2.0 would be much more appropriate (and I'm sure doable). But 36mm is not something many people wants? At second, LCD resolution (only 230k dots) is pathetic for 2000 USD/EUR worth camera. Definitely pathetic for camera relying on LCD focusing and framing. I would not care much in case of M9, but it's inexcusable in case of X1. Well, this low res LCD is silly in M9 too. Just because of the M9 price, there have to be used only the best parts! And 230k dots LCD is hardly the best one can buy in over 6000 USD/EUR worth camera.

But back to X1. Why I think the X1 is not so good as DP2 or LX3? Well, I see nothing really innovative here. DP2 is maybe not the best example of speed or user interface, but at least it uses Foveon! LX3 offer 24mm field of view and very reasonable noise/dynamic range performance. It's maybe not as good as will be X1. It's lens and user interface is far from ideal, but it can zoom, starts at f2.0/24mm and its price is much better in these days. So why should one buy X1? Just because of Leica brand or large sensor inside? Large sensor alone is not a guarantee of the best performance and value for money!

GF1 looks much better (nearly pocketable) solution for much less money. And according of many (pretty solid) rumors, Ricoh is working on similar system with interchangeable lenses. I believe it will be released later this year. So let's wait and see ;)
 
All you said about the cons of the Leica X1 is true (mostly the almost 2k u$s it will cost, really expensive), but I would like to see the quality of the pictures (I think the most important thing for me) that you can get with the Leica. I still keep with me an old point and shot Lumix camera with 6 megapixels and a Leica lens, and the quality of the jpegs is much better than those taken with the CX1. I think that Ricoh should try to make this type of fixed lens camera with a larger sensor so you can make very large prints with no loss of quality.
 
Of course, the image quality is always one of the main deciding factors. But not necessarily the most important one. Look for example at DP1/2. Despite reportedly better image quality delivered by Foveon, the ridiculous user interface and many other design quirks make this camera unattractive for many Ricoh users. In my opinion, it's only a question of time (I believe in really short time), when Ricoh announces something similar and possibly even better, because of much better user interface and feature set.
 
I hope so!!! I love Ricoh interface and build quality (when I bought the GRII a year ago I was recomended by a film M series Leica professional photographer!!!). And I´ll keep my beloved GRDII forever. The point is that for my photographics needs I´ll love to have "the camera" that suits everything I want from a camera, that is superb quality, compact size, easy to operate and mostly concentrated in taking pictures.
 
I am considering the X1, but would not pre-order or anything until I got a look and try of one. The IQ will have to something very good to make it worth paying out the asking price particularly as Pavel pointed out it has a poor LCD by todays standards. Its curious, will the IQ be better than the M8 but not as good as the M9?

However as the X1 won't be available till Jan 2010 I am expecting we'll hear about a new Ricoh compact before then, so its a no-brainer just to sit and wait and choose the best then.

In the meantime I'm going to have fun with my GRD III when it gets here! :D
 
I think what people are missing here is that the X1 is designed like a classic camera. It has a dedicated shutter speed dial and aperture dial... that is big to me... most compact digital cameras do not seem to be designed for photographers. Additionally, the user interface will be good... no superfluous crap in the menus. It is similar to the M8 / M9 in this respect. The sensor size and Leica lens are also pluses. This is a stripped down digital camera for photographers that will give Ricoh a run for the money in the ease of use / fun category. You are paying $2000 for the lens (look at the price of a 24mm f/2.8 lens for the M cameras - $4000) and for the sensor... it is the first of its kind and you are paying not only the Leica tax, but an early adopters fee as well. I hope Ricoh makes a similar camera and does it for under $1200. The new Ricoh does nothing for me... however a GRD IV with a large sensor sure would. Especially if they can keep it the same size as the III. The X1 is not truly pocketable... the GRD really is.
 
Re: Leica X1 - Case Color Differences

POST FULLY RETRACTED FOR BEING SHOWN TO BE ERRONEOUS INFORMATION.
 
Detailman

You have been posting this comments about grey/silver case versus black case in a variety of places. You need to go back and reread what Dpreview is doing. They are NOT testing the difference between black or grey case camera. They have one camera and are testing the amount of noise on a black or a grey patch in their test pattern. They use 3 different measurements for noise, chroma, black and grey. Whether or not you think this is a valid measurement of noise (it is one of many), it has NOTHING whatsoever to do with the color of the camera. There are no comparisons that DPREVIEW does between cameras with different case colors that I have seen.

Michael
 
sonomichele -

Is see that you are absolutely correct in what you say:
http://www.dpreview.com/learn/?/Glossar ... ent_01.htm
and that I have been absolutely misguided by my own lack of understanding of the actual meaning of the tests results.

Thank your bringing this up - and I apologize for bringing forth a "bum steer" in this matter of the interpretation of this data! ... :oops:
 
Re: Leica X1 - Case Color Differences

Detail Man":2ukc0tft said:
"Holy Cow, Batman !!!" (as his young protege Robin used to say) ... take a look at the magnitude difference (between the gray and the black colored case) luminance-noise graphs at:
http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/LeicaX1/page12.asp

They have made their graphic displays a little bit "slicker" lately. Use your mouse-pointer to click on the "black" and "gray" buttons directly below the "Noise Graphs" display to se the two individual sets of luminance-noise graphs.
Click to expand...

I'm pretty sure this is not to do with case colour either. For example as far as I am aware there is no G11 in any other colour than black. I think sonomichele is correct here.
 
sonomichele":1izydpc2 said:
Detailman

You have been posting this comments about grey/silver case versus black case in a variety of places. You need to go back and reread what Dpreview is doing. They are NOT testing the difference between black or grey case camera. They have one camera and are testing the amount of noise on a black or a grey patch in their test pattern. They use 3 different measurements for noise, chroma, black and grey. Whether or not you think this is a valid measurement of noise (it is one of many), it has NOTHING whatsoever to do with the color of the camera. There are no comparisons that DPREVIEW does between cameras with different case colors that I have seen.
Click to expand...
viewtopic.php?f=36&t=3121


sonomichele -

Is see that you are absolutely correct in what you say:
http://www.dpreview.com/learn/?/Glossar ... ent_01.htm
and that I have been absolutely misguided by my own lack of understanding of the actual meaning of the tests results.
Thank you for bringing this up - and I apologize for bringing forth a "bum steer" in this matter of the interpretation of this data! ... :oops:
 
This discussion does beg one question to me, and that is, can we be sure all the sensors in one model of camera are all consistent?
Could some perform slightly better or worse? Unlikely I guess, but has anyone tested it?
 
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